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Interview with Seth Dochter

We sat down with Seth on a pleasant March afternoon to discuss his love of photography. We learned about his passion for bringing the Lancaster community of photographers together through his photowalks as well as his penchant for preserving the history of our area through pictures. Read on to learn more about the man behind the Amish Road Show.

Seth Dochter Interview Lancaster Photography Instagrammer

Find Seth Online

sethdochter Instagram.JPG Seth Dochter @sethdochter
Find Seth Dochter online

I think you and I met around the time that the first lancastergram contest was going on, which you won. Tell me about that time in your life.

I had been using instagram for about a year, but I had actually been using other social media longer. Instagram didn't quite appeal to me first because I didn't know anybody, but when I went back and didn't concern myself with not knowing anybody and meeting new people, it was a really great experience. When the contest started up, I was very heavily active in that.

How did you find your way to the contest?

That's a good question, I don't remember (laughs). I might have been following Discover Lancaster when they announced it and then I just looked into it.

Is this the first contest you have done like that? Entering by using hashtags?

Yeah, definitely. Like I said, I'd been sharing Lancaster County for a few years with my Amish Roadshow page and website. It was a natural fit for me to jump right in and tag the pictures I was sharing anyway. Then I noticed right away the same faces. You start recognizing people and connecting with people and then the next thing you know, there's a little clique there.

Was there an overlap at all with the other social media platforms?

There was a little bit. Since I already had a following, I started talking about Instagram more, so people came over from Facebook. It's funny to see the people that came over from Facebook and kept posting to Instagram and Facebook simultaneously.

It is interesting how distinct these groups are.

Farm Summer Photo Seth Dochter It is interesting how distinct these groups are.

Each audience is different for each channel. People like my pictures on Instagram, but on Twitter, a picture helps, but some people don’t like pictures on Twitter at all. It's very different. When it started out, they didn't have pictures on Twitter, so the early onset of that group was all about text. Whereas Instagram, it's specifically focused on photography. It's an audience that really caught on quickly. It's been a lot of fun!

What other social media were you active in before Instagram came along?

I have a large trove of links behind me. From all sorts of different apps that I've tried. I always like trying different apps, especially for different things. One I remember was called Trover, it was very location-based. When you posted a picture in, let's say Bird-In-Hand, it would show all the other pictures posted, but spread out in range. You would start on so many feet, and then it would go to miles, and so on.

Did you find that there were many people on Trover?

There were quite a few, especially around here, but with our tourism around here it's not a surprise. People come from places where apps are adopted more quickly, like New York City. So when people come from places like that, they leave their trails of pictures, content, and stuff like that.

I imagine that's a good way to gain exposure for yourself, too.

Definitely. That's critical and sometimes it's time consuming and very hard, but being there everyday makes a difference in people seeing you.

What app do you find is easiest for you to generate an audience?

Cardinal Red Bird In Bush Seth Dochter What app do you find is easiest for you to generate an audience?

Well, let's go back to just generating an audience. Some of these apps do just go away. It's interesting to see how some of these apps reform and relaunch themselves. That stuff will stick around...you might still have a Myspace and not know it. A good example of this would be Flickr. They had some down times where they all but disappeared, but when they came back, everybody’s stuff was still there. The pictures were still associated with location, groups, and tags, so we're leaving behind information about a time and a place that might not exist the same way again.

It's very cool that that stuff is still out there, even if someone stumbles across it. I still get people that stumble upon content from five years ago and contact me and then I show them what I'm doing now and they are just like, “WOAH!” (laughs). It's really cool that we're leaving that trail of information about our area behind.

Seth and VLPA arrive at Mascot Roller Mill

This is a pretty cool area.

Yeah, this mill is actually open almost year round. They give you free tours and they go in and still have the machines set up and the historians will tell you about it. I think they even turn them on sometimes. Oh look, there's a swan over there. (starts snapping photos)

Do you usually see him here?

No...well I haven't been here for a bit. I used to work right up the street, so on lunch break I would drive down here and hang out for lunch.

We were talking earlier about documenting the area and leaving a trail. Do you think this area has changed much?

Strasburg Train Moving Seth Dochter We were talking earlier about documenting the area and leaving a trail. Do you think this area has changed much?

Oh yeah! I've lived here my whole life, so I see it very clearly. All the development and farms that have turned into developments, that's a big thing.

Even up into the woods, I just wrote a column today where I was talking about the nature preserve and how they've had some funding problems and battles with developers. It wasn't until the community, some churches, and some local townships came together and really pushed to raise money and save a huge section of the mountains up there that are still natural and basically untouched.

Where did you grow up?

New Holland

Do you wish that there were more photos of this area from when you were growing up?

There are some, but right now there isn’t a very good catalog of that information. It's challenging to find and that is something that I think about daily.

Tell me more about the things you are doing like Amish Roadshow and your adventure tours.

Intense Concentration Seth Dochter Tell me more about the things you are doing like Amish Roadshow and your adventure tours.

Initially Amish Roadshow was an idea to showcase Lancaster before people got here. I was going to do videos primarily, but that ended up being a huge commitment of time and resources that I wasn't quite able to grasp. I was starting from no experience, no knowledge, nothing to base off of. I was like...I like the internet, I like podcasts, so I'm going to make one.

As time went on and I got better cameras, the photography really took off. Then the focus become more of the photography then the video. Even now into photography, I'm very interested in things like 360 panos and stuff that's a bit more complicated than just photography.

I emailed Google a few months ago (I do business views for Google Maps), and suggested that it would be cool if there was a slider where you could change the time so you could time travel through street views. Ironically enough, he told me how excited he was about that and how cool he thought it was, but it was not the focus of Google Maps. It's a map and not an archive. I jokingly responded to him and was like, “Well, if you guys aren’t up for the task…” (laughs) I kinda poked at him and he kind of brushed it off. But a month later there was a slider on street view where you can slide through time.

No kidding!

Yeah. If I have an idea like that and they do it, that's fine. I’m cool with that!

I know other photographs capture areas in different seasons, but you could do that with history if it was archived well enough.

Now that I have a few years of media stored up, I can see it even more. There are spots where I’m like, “Look how that has changed!” There's always some development going on in Lancaster. In some ways it's really cool. The Lancaster County Conservancy is doing a great job of purchasing property to conserve it, but then allowing public access and use to it. That’s really cool.

One of our favorite parks is the Ephrata Community Township Park and it was the old Ephrata quarry. I remember driving by as a kid and seeing the heavy machinery out there and my mom telling me to NOT go there, that that place is not safe and I would drown! I was like, "Okay, I won’t go there!" Then years later, it's this beautiful park and it's huge. They have trails that go through the woods and up around the quarry. I wish I could take my kayak in there but other then that, it's a really nice park. There's a pond on the west end of the park, so at sunset, you have a beautiful reflection of it. It's a beautiful spot. But, years ago I was warned not to go to it because it was dangerous. So, not all change is bad. There's definitely good change in the works as well.

You said you started out with video. What about that was so time consuming?

Hot Air Balloon Photo Seth Dochter You said you started out with video. What about that was so time consuming?

Just the editing of the video. When I started I just had Windows and Windows Movie Maker, which is for basic home movies. My computer wasn’t able to handle it, so I would drop the videos in there and the computer would crash. I would have to reboot the computer. There would be times where I would edit the video and save it, then turn the computer off and let it cool down, turn it on as quickly as I could, and process the video before it crashed from overheating. I didn’t have anything else...that's what I had. As time went on, I got a little money here and a little money there and bought a better camera and software, then that's where we are today.

You still do a lot of video, but more with your GoPro, right?

Yeah, it's mostly snippets nowadays because people really like micro-content. To sit down and make like a full five minute video, you're talking hours of work. Even if you're experienced and you really want to do it well, you're going to spend hours on it.

Do you find most people do it well or care?

There are a lot of people that do, and a lot of people that don't. And there are a lot of people that don’t just because they don't know how. I want every photo to be better than the last, I want every video to be better than the last. I want every location to be better than the last, which is really hard when you find an awesome location! Like a certain Cold Weather Photography Tour! Once you hit something really epic, it's like, “Man, what do I do next?”

Don’t you continue to surprise yourself? You really surprise me with your photography, it's like how can he beat that!

Reading Pagoda Seth Dochter.JPG Don’t you continue to surprise yourself? You really surprise me with your photography it's like how can he beat that!

I'll go to some really awesome place or some beautiful sunset or something and wonder what to do next. Well, I’ll just go out at night instead. To completely switch it and take people’s mind off of the last epic picture. If you do an epic sunset, and then the next day there's another epic sunset, they're going to associate the two. If I do one sunset and then another, the second sunset will not get as much attention because it's the second time they've seen it.

One nice thing that I try to do is when I go to some place, I try to do as much as possible. I will stop as many times as possible in between, and at each location. I will try to get as many perspectives as possible, so I can feed off of that for months. It might be a month later when it's terrible outside and I have no good pictures that week, or I was sick. I can just reach into the trove and I have some interesting stuff.

It's partially economical because if I am going to drive to Reading, like the other night, I stopped because I saw six or seven mission accomplished at once. I wanted the pagoda from the city and the city from the pagoda, I wanted a panoramic. I've never been there at sunset. so the west sky is always boring when I get there. I've been there at sunrise and that's not helpful because the west is still pretty boring. But it happened that night when the storm was coming.

How did that happen? Did you see the storm coming and had to shoot it from the pagoda? How did you end up there?

I had some people contact me about pictures of the pagoda. One friendly elderly couple who are having their 50th wedding anniversary, they have an attachment to it and that is what they wanted. I was going up there to get some different perspectives from what I already had.

So you were just lucky in the moment.

Reading Storm Photo Seth Dochter So you were just lucky in the moment.

Right, and that night it happened to be 60 degrees instead of 20. I knew I wanted to go at night, and it was a great night to do so, and I wasn’t going to go because of the storm. I was watching the storm on radar and I was going outside periodically to see how it was turning out.

When I went to Reading, directly over Reading was completely clear, but the storm was east behind the pagoda, and to the west on the other side of town. I was able to shoot both directions and double-up, and it just so happens that in the west is where they had some lightening. That added something to the skyline on the west that I was never able to capture before.

What was funny was that there were these two girls there walking around and they saw me taking pictures of the lightning. The one girl was like, “AH that's a good idea!” So, she was trying to take picture with her phone. The camera doesn’t always matter, but sometimes it does matter. (laughs) She was trying to take pictures with her phone of like, a burst shot, so I told them if the lightening strikes over there, in a few seconds it will strike over there. They thanked me, and unfortunately, they got frustrated and couldn’t do it. Even I only escaped with two little tiny pieces of lightning bolt, but patience does factor in. You have to have the right time, the right place, and the right conditions...and then you got to wait.

You are there trying to get this amazing shot and helping other people get an awesome shot too?!

Yeah, I know. I think that's awesome. I’m not a big fan of doing many tutorials in photography. I can teach people, and I can explain things to people, but it's just not something that suits me very well. At any opportunity, if I have to encourage someone to take photos, I definitely will.

I look at all kinds of photos on Instagram. I look at all the tags. I don’t just look at certain people, so I see all kinds of photos. Maybe you see somebody who has a shot that's really good, and they got lucky that time, but the rest of their shots aren't really that good. But, I will definitely take a moment to comment and be like, “Hey man, that's a great shot!” And encourage him or her to maybe take more of an interest into how they got that shot and to start thinking about it.

You've always been trying to grow our community of photographers and keeping them motivated.

With the photowalks, what I like about them is it's not like a tutorial, or like a training session. We all come together and we can talk amongst each other. I don’t know everything, I don’t even begin to know everything, but when we all get together, it brings a lot more then if everybody came and I was like, “Alright, listen up!”

Do you want to learn from other photographers too?

Nuclear Power Plant Seth Dochter Do you want to learn from other photographers too?

Oh, yeah. There are always things to learn from other people and you see how people do things differently. It's very easy in photography to get stuck in your own bad habits, because it's kind of a lonely pursuit usually. Yeah, you can get out and shoot with other people, like you and your wife might take pictures. But, for the most part, when you're getting serious, like looking for the perfect landscape, you're by yourself out in the field in the middle of the night.

It is very, very easy to get caught in your bad habits as far as f-stop or shutter speed and things like that. You might see how somebody took a shot, and you took the same shot, and ALWAYS at the end of a photowalk it's different. You can take pictures of the exact same thing, but the perspective is always different. Then, with the editing, you can get radically different results. That's really cool though, because I've never been so much about having the perfect photo, technically. I'm more of a story teller.

Does the equipment matter more to you then? Are you yearning to spend three, four, five thousand dollars to take better shots?

If I had it! (laughs) The thing is, I try to be forward thinking as far technology in cameras. If I'm going to have the money to spend to buy a camera, I'm going to buy the camera that I want, and make sure it's the one that I want. I heavily researched before I got my mirrorless, and because I do HDR all the time, it's a very good fit for me. It's a great camera for anybody, but for me without the mirror flapping up and down between each bracket, I get less chance of movement in the scene itself. That's just right for me.

There's this Canon vs. Nikon battle, and there are pros and cons to each, but this mirrorless from Sony perfectly fits what I'm trying to do. The others just haven’t done it yet, because they're stuck in their pattern of this is how it's done, and if we take the mirror away, it's not an SLR.

I would have never thought before I bought this camera that I'd buy a Sony. You would almost think they're a disruptor.

I definitely think they're a disruptor. Nikon is coming out with the DL series which is their major push towards mirrorless. They're going to be doing this big push for DL, and it's unfortunate that so many people will just jump on that because it's Nikon. I've already had my Sony for a year, and it's three-years-old, and the new one's coming out. When people ask why I bought the A6000, I say it's because I can’t afford the A7Rii. The full-frame, mirrorless cameras are killing it right now! They're being used everywhere!

Do you find that with the progression of your photography, that going full-frame matters more than before?

Seth And A Neon Graffiti Walls Do you find that with the progression of your photography that going full-frame matters more than before?

I don’t care personally. It would be nice to have a full-frame camera, but if you take a few steps back, it's not that big of a deal. The camera is not really everything. The camera didn’t make my photos popular with people so much as my perspective, because I can still go back to my old camera and still take great photos. I don’t feel like it's had that much of an effect. People like my pictures from my GoPro, people like my pictures from my phone, and people like my pictures from my camera.

So, it's the artist over the equipment.

Yeah. But, equipment definitely plays a role. I think when you get to a certain point, you want to do things that are more complicated and harder to do with these cameras, because sometimes they scale things down to make it cheaper. For night time, there are a lot of things I want to do that will look good on this camera, but would look GREAT on a full-frame, top-of-the-line camera. And, glass matters more than full body, I would say. If I could afford more lenses, then that would make a huge difference.

With the Sony, you can use lenses from other brands. You lose some of the automatic stuff, but you can still use a different brand lens?

Trey Photo Walk With the Sony you can use lenses from other brands. You lose some of the automatic stuff but you can still use a different brand lens?

They have adaptors for all kinds of stuff. One of my big inspirations as far as photography was Trey Ratcliff. I partially bought the Sony on his recommendation, but he does all sorts of different things that I don’t have the opportunity of doing. He will put lenses on that just get beautiful results that I can’t get.

You went to one of his walks, right?

Yeah, I went to the Trey USA tour in Philadelphia.

Pretty good time?

Absolutely! The only thing is when you get to that size of a photowalk, it's chaos. There's just a mob! I think there was somewhere between 100 and 150 people.

Do you find it is difficult to get a unique shot in a group that size?

Harrisburg Capital Building Seth Dochter Do you find it is difficult to get a unique shot in a group that size?

No, no it actually wasn’t. The people in the front kind of keep it moving, and then people just lag behind. Eventually, you just get stretched out to the point that you will see people stopping at the next interesting thing, like big interesting thing, but you still see people pointing their lenses in all different directions to find the little interesting things that they might see that you don’t. Like this tree looks awesome in your sunglasses, but you wouldn’t know that!

It was a really great time though, and I met a lot of really cool people that I've never met before. And, I’d say overall, it was a great success. That was my first time getting to Philly since taking photography seriously, so that was a lot of fun to get down there and shoot. Very different than out here.

Do you find that you're expanding out more to try to find something unique?

I still shoot here all the time and there are still endless possibilities, but I like getting out to see unique things that you can’t see here. The Reading pagoda, to me, is really cool, because it's up on the hill, and at night, you can see out over the city. We don’t have something like that here where you can see over Lancaster, and I wish we did. That would be super cool.

Do you ever feel maybe territorial over places where people are going and taking your shots?

No, not at all.

You are wide open in sharing your spots?

I get people saying that they went to a spot because I told them to, so I don’t make it a secret. There's a level of me promoting places that I like. I'll go to places that I like intentionally, because they're getting exposure from me taking pictures. There's an element of that.

Do you have places you go with your adventure tours to reward establishments?

Seth Sitting Down Getting Ready For Interviews Do you have places you go with your adventure tours to reward establishments?

That was something that I tried to do last year, and I tried to do kayak tours on the Conestoga River, because we got kayaks last year and it was just the coolest thing. We love it! There is no perspective like it. When you get out on the river, it snakes through areas that you're not going to see from the road. You're going to see the farm from the back where there are no telephone poles between you and the farm. The animals walk right up to the edge of the water and stand there and drink.

I thought it was really cool and the response that I got, so I started a Kickstarter to raise the money to do it, and we were pre-selling tickets to the kayak tour and it did not go over well at all! People were not interested. I didn’t just launch it, I asked hundreds and hundreds of people what they thought and they all thought it was awesome! But, when it came time to do it, people just weren’t really interested. The saddest part is if it actually worked, and they got out into the water, they would have seen how cool it is.

One of the things I'm thinking about doing this year is doing more individualized tours, and make it like a legitimate business. Maybe, just be like a tour guide and go places where you can rent kayaks and we'll take you out and show you interesting stuff. That would be something worth pursuing just for fun. Last year, I tried to go into more money making ideas with my photography and it honestly didn’t go well. It's very challenging and there's a lot of competition. It's not really the competition though, it's people who are willing to settle. If I were a business owner, I would want to hire a photographer to get the best image of my business. It's not to say that people who aren’t photographers can’t, but a lot of times nowadays, you find local businesses settling.

Sometimes people don’t know about the higher level of production.

A big problem with that is when you have guys like me who want to take pictures for you for a moderate price and we can’t. And then when we do get jobs, we have to charge more because we don’t sell as often. If more people would buy more pictures, it would even it out a little bit. It's rough because there are a lot of people that will do stuff for cheap, or for free, or somebody knows somebody. Just like everything, you have to find your unique niche.

I think there would be plenty of work out there if you compromised your art.

That's another thing, I’m a little hard to get along with. (laughs)

I am seriously in awe at that comment, I would seriously never think that of you! Everybody would say you were the nicest guy they know.

I’m not a mean guy, but I don’t compromise my art, and I am not going to compromise my art. I take a hard line at what I consider selling out. I will do things for money, and I will do things where people will get attention from me promoting them, but it's never a place that I don’t believe in. I only work with people that I believe in and I want to support.

What are your thoughts on photographing the Amish?

Buggy Through Covered Bridge Seth Dochter Lancaster.JPG What are your thoughts on photographing the Amish?

You're going to go there, huh? (laughs) My opinion was a little swayed this morning. I've always said that I just don’t take pictures of the Amish, and I don’t really take pictures of people anyway. I really like the people, I just personally don’t care for it, because it is kind of invasive. That has been my opinion on capturing the Amish. I see these pictures, and it could not be any more invasive than that! (laughs) The full crop is the guy's face, hat, and beard. That's all really unnecessary.

You said your opinion was just recently swayed, how so?

Say you were at a mud sale for instance, that's a little different as long as you're not up in people’s faces. It is a little different, because you are capturing, like I said before, a time and a place and an energy that might not exist later. The Amish are not dwindling in population, I would say, and they are spreading out, but that's not to say that the culture isn't changing.

My understanding is that they don’t want the photos themselves for the vanity. They will not hang a picture of themselves on the wall.

I have heard some interesting perspectives on the vanity part, and it really depends on that Amish person’s upbringing and all of that. There are some that don’t mind, and there are some that mind a lot. There are some that will tell you if they see you taking their picture that they mind.

I think that would be any people though. If anyone, Amish or not, asked to not have their picture taken, then I won’t.

You have to be totally respectful. One of my favorite photos that I ever captured in downtown Lancaster was two guys playing guitar at the bus station. It was the first Friday, and it was late, so it was dark so the way that the lights were coming off the overhang...you could see these two guys jamming out, and you see that it says Queen Street Station in white lights above. So it's coming out at you, and there were passers-by looking. That is one of my favorite pictures, but I don’t feel like it was really that invasive. It’s a personal opinion, if you are cool with it, then that's fine.

Now tell me more about your processes from camera to social media.

Seth In Inner Harbor Baltimore Now tell me more about your processes from camera to social media.

Typically, it's a lengthy process. I do quite a bit of post processing on most of my photos, and I don't really change much, but when I do change stuff you KNOW I change stuff. As far as the scene, I don’t really take things out. I've been told before that I should take power lines out of a picture. No, that is the picture, the power lines are there. Why should I take out something that's there? A lot of people disagree with me on that, but a lot of people would agree strongly with me on that.

I will never say that I've never taken something out of a picture, but I have pictures of the river and creek where there was trash in it, and I will leave it there so people can see.

If you pulled up Photoshop, you could pull the trash out pretty quickly?

Yeah. Part of the problem is that I don’t think about it like that anymore. Earlier, I joked with Steph, and asked if it was ethical or not to put a whole crowd in a park scene. I knew the answer but I just think it's funny because I could totally do that. And if all works out, I have a great April Fool's Day joke planned with Photoshop!

I think it is perfectly fine to put out shopped work as long as it is noted as such, right?

I do some heavy adjustments to the colors, and the lighting, and stuff like that.

In Photoshop?

Yes. Well I use a variety of programs, such as, Photoshop and Lightroom. But, then I use a bunch of plugins from Topaz Labs for Photoshop, and then I have a few other apps on my phone. Sometimes, depending on what I want to do, I will send it to my phone and make a few more adjustments.

For the most part, I make lighting and color adjustments, but there's an element that I associate with impressionism in painting where it's not just the scene itself, but I'm also adding my feeling on what that scene looked like to me. That is how you get that variation from a photowalk of that same shot from two different people. We both add our little piece to it. I don’t have a problem with that, but in some instances you really shouldn't edit much.

Like putting an airplane in a tiny hole in a tunnel like the Nikon controversy. Did you hear about that?

No.

Some guy Photoshopped an airplane through a tunnel, and pretended like it was original work. Nikon believed it and gave that guy an award.

Small World Amish Farm Seth Dochter Some guy Photoshopped an airplane through a tunnel and pretended like it was original work. Nikon believed it and gave that guy an award.

There's a time and a place for any kind of editing you want to do. I make those tiny planet pictures and I think it's the coolest thing. Not everybody likes it, but I don't care, because I like it! (laughs)

Is a lot of your art that way?

There are times where I'm drawn to pull things that I know my fans will like. There are times where I'll choose one picture over another at a certain time of day, because it will be more popular.

Well you're building your brand and your business too, so you have to have some calculation in this, right?

Yeah. If you want to take pictures and be a photographer, that's part of it, but how you go about it is a whole other thing.

When you come home with a roll of photos, what percentage do you publish, what percentage are your favorites, and what percentage won’t see the light of day?

Starlight Sky Seth Dochter When you come home with a roll of photos what percentage do you publish what percentage are your favorites and what percentage won’t see the light of day?

That depends on the day, and the trip, and what I did. The run up to Reading, I think I got about ten keepers out of that for different things. That's cool, but I probably shoot, like 200 photos. There are people that will complain about that, but part of how I get so much done in one run is that I stick and move. I’m like snap, snap, snap, go!

Sometimes that also puts me at a disadvantage, because I get home and a setting was wrong, or there was some problem. That’s when a part of me gets all zen and is just like...let it go. (laughs) If I am on a super serious assignment, everything's going to be right. If I am just driving around taking pictures, and the pictures are wrong, then it isn't a huge deal.

To wrap this up, is there anything you want to mention about your side projects?

I do a monthly column in Lancaster County Magazine called "Backyard Tourist", so people can check that out. I usually try to save nice pictures for that of interesting places I like to go. I;ve also been doing a lot of stuff with Google Maps recently, and Street Views. It is kind of hard to find my profile on that. I’m going to be launching a new site, so all of that will be coming shortly. It will be more focused on photography on an archival aspect as opposed to a tourism and things to do aspect. I'm hoping it will be a little bit of a merger of both. Always under development, and I am not going anywhere!

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